Monet - Week 2

[txchristy281]

Then when I try to open up dialogue and make you aware of my feelings, you accuse me of playing the race card and I'm using the term "you" in general. So, it becomes a vicious cycle of you feeling that I should just get over it and stop playing the race card, and me thinking that you're an insensitive bigot who doesn't really care or respect me enough as a human being to hear what I'm saying and try to understand my perspective.

Denise4925 - To a MUCH lesser degree, I can identify with being judged based on outer appearance. B.C. (Before children) I was young, skinny, blonde, big boobed (there is a point in every woman's life she becomes a 36C- LONG) etc. To top it off, I was and still am "bubbly." I also have an IQ that beats Matt's... That did not matter to professors, employers, or even the clerk at the grocery store... I was type cast as an airhead bimbo. I had to be twice as smart, work twice as hard, and fight twice as hard for the recognition I deserved. Because of this, it ticks me off to no end when I hear someone judging another person based on physical appearence.

In the same breath, I grew up in an area where I was not the majority. I currently live in an area where I am not the majority. The vast majority of my friends are not white. And, for those who don't know me and automatically assume that because I am complete white bread - I am racist - I become VERY defensive. Because again, I am being judged on my appearence.

Your quote completely sums up the race issue for most Americans. It really is a vicious cycle. A white guys feels judged and gets defensive.. furthering the feeling of lack of understanding. This in turn causes more racism. So the real question is... how do we end the cycle? Where does the Merry-Go-Round stop?

[Slimcruz]

I think that Monet might have done better with another group. I still believe that BB lags in their effort to provide a true ethnic mix on the show.

[txchristy281]

I think that Monet might have done better with another group. I still believe that BB lags in their effort to provide a true ethnic mix on the show.

I think if she would have tried a little harder to make friends she would have done better. Look at Kaysar... Being of Middle Eastern decent with 9/11 still so fresh in people's minds. His back was against a wall that he did not build and he still became very popular.

[laladoopiedu]

I'm glad Monet is gone. Better her than Matt.

[Auroradawn]

I don't know, but maybe you have an air of superiority or fear in your face or even a look of disgust when you encounter your minority students. I don't know. Maybe instead of thinking that just because you're white, all black people think you're a racist because one black person accused you of it, maybe you should try to open up a dialogue about it with your students. That would give you both an arena for you to hear their perspective and let them hear yours. However, you can't have fear of the outcome or get overly emotional and get defensive when things start feeling uncomfortable, and you can't have pre-conceived notions going into it. Maybe you can start by talking to the person who said they felt you were a racist and ask them why they feel that way. If we don't communicate on the issue, nothing will ever get resolved and the races will continue to harbor ill feelings and feelings of insensitivity deep down.

I don't have an air of superiority, darling. I wouldn't have gone into teaching if I did because it is very likely in teaching that you DO encounter different types of students, and I wanted to be a teacher since I was a small child. No offense, but that's almost like saying I think I'm better than black people and in a sense saying I'm racist and of course I am not either of the two. The staff at my school love me and know I'm a friendly, bubbly, easy-going, somewhat dingbatty person. I know I sound different in writing, but if you met me in person you would probably think, "Well, she's pretty cool."

But you are right. I do think it's RIDICULOUS what happened to black people for hundreds of years as it's ridiculous what happened to Indians, Jews, women, etc. (Indians were actually persecuted in this past century btw, but mostly in the 1800's and before that- being forced to move off their land into reservations, and their children were forced to cut their hair which was against their religion and be Christianized. They were forced to work in homes away from their families, and some were beaten, too. The Holocaust happened when Hitler was around in the 1930's, but the Jews were also persecuted in Egypt -Moses?- and in Europe long before the Holocaust for centuries. People hated them. No persecution is okay in my book. So how I feel is that we really have our own story to tell.

I really liked your idea above btw. I'm trying to figure out how I might do that this year. I want the kids to truly know how much I care about them as individuals and their people's struggles throughout history. I want to put the major focus on their accomplishments, dreams, etc., and put a little emphasis on other cultures as well.

[Fatcat]

due to a power outage I didn't get to see the show or Monet get evicted or any of the goodby messages. Having extreme heat wave here which caused the outage, what a time to get one, huh, I didn't like hate Monet, she just did not impress me in any way as having much game, and I think her teaming up with Brittney hurt her in the long run.

[Auroradawn]

Yeah, but I would have liked to have seen her get another chance. She said she would have played the game differently if she could do it all again. So who knows? Maybe she'll get to go back into the BB house. Either her or Annie going back is cool with me, but with Monet Brit would get her friend back. It would be hilarious again. Somehow I don't think Brit's going to be able to mudsling with her words around others as she could with Monet because I think most of them would laugh but then walk off and report what she was saying. I think she knows she has to play it safe now and at least pretend like she likes the people in the BB house.

[Fatcat]

after the lie Matt told about his wife, I was more than willing to see him get kicked to the curb, I thought that it was really not the thing to do, I mean to each his own, but I think you should not put things like what he said about his wife out into the universe, you just never know, I just do not like him so much now and he seems to be getting cockier by the second, so I would have rather seen Monet stay and him gone.

[Auroradawn]

after the lie Matt told about his wife, I was more than willing to see him get kicked to the curb, I thought that it was really not the thing to do, I mean to each his own, but I think you should not put things like what he said about his wife out into the universe, you just never know, I just do not like him so much now and he seems to be getting cockier by the second, so I would have rather seen Monet stay and him gone.

And that's the way it should have been. Which leads me to think that these HG have no clue. I mean who was a bigger threat - Annie or Rachel? Rachel was because she was and is tied to Brenda at the hip. Of course, they didn't know that nor did they know that Annie was the saboteur and only had 4 weeks to go before she took the money and left. Who was a bigger threat this week - Matt or Monet? Matt was. I am astonished as I see that both Annie AND Monet told them this, and the HG are still so retarded. In past seasons, it seems like an alliance would make a deal with another alliance on who to vote out, and they always tried to send the stronger player home when they could. This house... reeks. They're not thinking.

[Fatcat]

it's a pretty boring house so far, just getting to watch the after dark and Matt is sure full of himself,lol I need to find last night show so I can watch it

[nothingbutlove4bb]

nothingbutlove, I so appreciate what you're saying here, but it goes deeper than just being a product of mistrust. What many of you don't understand is that black people experience racism everyday in some form or another. It may just be a look, a word, a gesture or something more overt like not being given the benefit of the doubt over someone of European ancestory in a job situation or even a traffic accident, or being pulled over because you look suspicious or even someone making a joke on a reality show message board. My point is it comes in all forms and basically unnoticeable to people who don't experience it.

Otherwise, I agree with everything you've said and I appreciate your willingness to engage in dialogue about the issue and your openness to another's perspective.

Denise, you are awesome. I do understand more than you think. I am a black female. Most people think I am just Hispanic or Middle Eastern. I may have that ancestry, however my parents are both black. Enthnicity is a little different. My mom is African Cuban and my dad is Black American. I will PM you, it sounds like we could have some great conversations

[nothingbutlove4bb]

Yeah Matt is really working my nerves. I kinda miss Monet, but I am looking foward to seeing how thier decision to keep Matt changes the game.

[Denise4925]

Denise4925 - To a MUCH lesser degree, I can identify with being judged based on outer appearance. B.C. (Before children) I was young, skinny, blonde, big boobed (there is a point in every woman's life she becomes a 36C- LONG) etc. To top it off, I was and still am "bubbly." I also have an IQ that beats Matt's... That did not matter to professors, employers, or even the clerk at the grocery store... I was type cast as an airhead bimbo. I had to be twice as smart, work twice as hard, and fight twice as hard for the recognition I deserved. Because of this, it ticks me off to no end when I hear someone judging another person based on physical appearence.

In the same breath, I grew up in an area where I was not the majority. I currently live in an area where I am not the majority. The vast majority of my friends are not white. And, for those who don't know me and automatically assume that because I am complete white bread - I am racist - I become VERY defensive. Because again, I am being judged on my appearence.

Your quote completely sums up the race issue for most Americans. It really is a vicious cycle. A white guys feels judged and gets defensive.. furthering the feeling of lack of understanding. This in turn causes more racism. So the real question is... how do we end the cycle? Where does the Merry-Go-Round stop?

I think it helps to have open frank discussions like we are attempting to have here. It also helps that people don't get on the defensive and just really listen to, without invalidating, how the other party feels. That way, we are not jumping to conclusions about the other.

I think that Monet might have done better with another group. I still believe that BB lags in their effort to provide a true ethnic mix on the show.

I truly believe this as well.

[Auroradawn]

I think that Monet might have done better with another group. I still believe that BB lags in their effort to provide a true ethnic mix on the show.

I fully agree, and they don't do great with their casting of Ragan either. He's like every other gay guy I've seen on the show. Entertaining and sweet, yes, but there are other types of people out there. I would love to see a way more diversified BB. I think it would bring in more of a range of personalities, strategies, and opinions. It would be kick a@@!!!

Denise4925 - To a MUCH lesser degree, I can identify with being judged based on outer appearance. B.C. (Before children) I was young, skinny, blonde, big boobed (there is a point in every woman's life she becomes a 36C- LONG) etc. To top it off, I was and still am "bubbly." I also have an IQ that beats Matt's... That did not matter to professors, employers, or even the clerk at the grocery store... I was type cast as an airhead bimbo. I had to be twice as smart, work twice as hard, and fight twice as hard for the recognition I deserved. Because of this, it ticks me off to no end when I hear someone judging another person based on physical appearence.

In the same breath, I grew up in an area where I was not the majority. I currently live in an area where I am not the majority. The vast majority of my friends are not white. And, for those who don't know me and automatically assume that because I am complete white bread - I am racist - I become VERY defensive. Because again, I am being judged on my appearence.

Your quote completely sums up the race issue for most Americans. It really is a vicious cycle. A white guys feels judged and gets defensive.. furthering the feeling of lack of understanding. This in turn causes more racism. So the real question is... how do we end the cycle? Where does the Merry-Go-Round stop?

Yes. I totally agree with you. That's what I'm talking about! I get targeted for the same things you mentioned. It's unfair for everyone really. You can't win. It is a vicious cycle.

[Denise4925]

I don't have an air of superiority, darling. I wouldn't have gone into teaching if I did because it is very likely in teaching that you DO encounter different types of students, and I wanted to be a teacher since I was a small child. No offense, but that's almost like saying I think I'm better than black people and in a sense saying I'm racist and of course I am not either of the two. The staff at my school love me and know I'm a friendly, bubbly, easy-going, somewhat dingbatty person. I know I sound different in writing, but if you met me in person you would probably think, "Well, she's pretty cool."

But you are right. I do think it's RIDICULOUS what happened to black people for hundreds of years as it's ridiculous what happened to Indians, Jews, women, etc. (Indians were actually persecuted in this past century btw, but mostly in the 1800's and before that- being forced to move off their land into reservations, and their children were forced to cut their hair which was against their religion and be Christianized. They were forced to work in homes away from their families, and some were beaten, too. The Holocaust happened when Hitler was around in the 1930's, but the Jews were also persecuted in Egypt -Moses?- and in Europe long before the Holocaust for centuries. People hated them. No persecution is okay in my book. So how I feel is that we really have our own story to tell.

I really liked your idea above btw. I'm trying to figure out how I might do that this year. I want the kids to truly know how much I care about them as individuals and their people's struggles throughout history. I want to put the major focus on their accomplishments, dreams, etc., and put a little emphasis on other cultures as well.

First, I wouldn't know if you had an air of superiority because I don't know you. I'm just suggesting possible feelings or ideas they may have about you, thinking you are racist. Whether you are or not and whether other people think you are or not is irrelevant to what they feel or think about you until you actually talk to them. Based on you calling me "darling" to open your response, could have made me defensive and think that you were being condescending, but I feel I can rise above those initial reactions and give you a chance by reading your whole post. Which I did.

Second, I'm not trying nor would I ever try to compare human tragedies, such as the enslavement of Africans in America and the Holocaust or the genocide of the Native American or any other group that has gone through an horrific time. I was merely trying to illustrate how close to home slavery is to black people, even now. And how deeply it effected and still effects black Americans and America as a whole.

One set of persecution does not negate or diminish what happened to the other. One is not worse than the other. But bringing up other instances of persecution when I'm trying to tell you about what my people went through and still go through so that you can understand where I'm coming from, does not help. It makes me feel that you are trying to somehow diminish, devalue and invalidate my claims and my feelings. It makes me think that you don't want to hear me. It makes me feel that you feel uncomfortable and in order to alleviate your feelings of discomfort, you tell me that other people have gone through the same or worse. It's not productive. I recognize and empathize with all people who were persecuted and are still persecuted. However, we were not discussing them. You brought up how you hate that black people are "still using the race card in 2010". You brought up how you feel blacks in your school think you were racist just because you are white. I'm trying, as a black person, to give you some insight into what's going on with them, but instead of hearing me, you seem to give reasons why they are wrong in how they feel, and I'm sure those reasons are very valid, but you are missing an opportunity to find out what the real problem is. You are accusing them of reverse racism and by doing that, you're guilty of the very same thing you're accusing them of doing. That is, they are looking at you and making a judgment without all of the facts and you're looking at them making a judgment (in this case you think they think you're racist because you're white) without all of the facts. If you don't talk about it, which I'm glad that you like my suggestion, it will continue to be this cycle of mistrust.

If you're going to have this discussion with your students, please don't get defensive or have pre-conceived notions walking in there. Please just have an open mind and listen. Try to understand every aspect of their perspective and give them your perspective so that they will see your side.

[CeCiMom]

I think it helps to have open frank discussions like we are attempting to have here. It also helps that people don't get on the defensive and just really listen to, without invalidating, how the other party feels. That way, we are not jumping to conclusions about the other.

You're right... open, frank discussions help and there is a great conversation going on here. However, Morty's is not the place to have it.

If you (or anyone else involved in this discussion) would like to continue this conversation privately that is fine but, remember to stay within our guidelines. Here are a couple of links to jog the memories of those that need it; http://www.tvfanforums.net/index.php?showtopic=7 Also, http://www.tvfanforums.net/index.php?showannouncement=5&f=9

Morty's is all about TV and we strive to make it as little about anything else as possible.

So, NO MORE discussion about racism. Any, posts that are reflective of this conversation will receive a warning level increase. It's time to get back on topic... Monet, Big Brother 12 house guest.

[GingerSnaps]

she applied for ANTM 2x and did not get on, I do not see her as anything but s commerical model at best

When Tyra turns you down then it must be bad especially when Tyra accepts transvestites and 4 ft 9 inch girls to be on the show.

[Fatcat]

You got that one right Ginger, that says it all,lolol

[Denise4925]

I felt so sorry for Monet last night. I'm happy she got $10K out of it and I hope it's more than Brenda, Rachel and Kristin get.

I like the way Enzo told her not to take it to heart. I think he really cared for her. He felt the game was too much for her, plus she was a victim of Wild E. Matty Super Genius game play. Who can win against that?

[arrowhead]

I felt so sorry for Monet last night. I'm happy she got $10K out of it and I hope it's more than Brenda, Rachel and Kristin get.

I like the way Enzo told her not to take it to heart. I think he really cared for her. He felt the game was too much for her, plus she was a victim of Wild E. Matty Super Genius game play. Who can win against that?

If Monet had only said 100 gallons ,Enzo

[Auroradawn]

I felt so sorry for Monet last night. I'm happy she got $10K out of it and I hope it's more than Brenda, Rachel and Kristin get.

I like the way Enzo told her not to take it to heart. I think he really cared for her. He felt the game was too much for her, plus she was a victim of Wild E. Matty Super Genius game play. Who can win against that?

It will be more than Brenda, Rachel, and Kristen get.

Yeah. Enzo seems like a sweetheart. I think it's just a game to him. He doesn't have anything personal against anybody in the house.

[GingerSnaps]

I wonder who Monet will punch when she gets home?

[Slimcruz]

I think that Monet, thirty years from now, will be a happy, successful, loved and loving woman. She will learn from this. Monet got caught-up in all the junior high name-calling and it got away from her. It could happen to any of us under similar circumstances. I like her and wish her well.

[CeCiMom]

You maybe right slim. I think Enzo had it right, this game wasn't for her... even if the reason she went home was her own doing. She just didn't understand this game enough to play with the big dogs!

[ImIn]

she applied for ANTM 2x and did not get on, I do not see her as anything but s commerical model at best

Somebody was savvy enough to see the model in her....too good for ANTM as far as I'm concerned.

Apparently she's modeled at NY Fashion week and St. Louis Fashion Week. Link to pictures and article here

and still more pictures here at Campbell agency

Granted...she's not the next big thing to hit the runway...but she is more established than people here make her out to be.