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JEDI

Episode #11: I Just Like The Recess Part

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Caution: major (?) SPOILER

TAYLOR IS BANNED FROM ENJOYING BONANZA CITY, AND THE TOWN COUNCIL SELECTS ONE PIONEER TO POLICE THE TOWN, ON "KID NATION," WEDNESDAY, NOV. 28

"I Just Like the Recess Part" - The Town Council bans Taylor from having fun, and she has a surprising reaction when her friends brag about the good times they're having without her. Meanwhile, the Council makes an interesting choice when they pick a law enforcer for Bonanza City,

on KID NATION, Wednesday, Nov. 28 (8:00-9:00 PM, ET/PT) on the CBS Television Network.

The Pioneers are: Alex, Anjay, Blaine, Brett, Campbell, Colton, Divad, DK, Emilie, Eric, Gianna, Greg, Guylan, Hunter, Jared, Jasmine, Kelsey, Kennedy, Laurel, Leila, Madison, Maggie, Mallory, Markelle, Michael, Migle, Mike, Morgan, Natasha, Nathan, Olivia, Pharaoh, Randi, Savannah, Sophia, Sophie, Taylor and Zach.

RATING: To Be Announced

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SPOILERS BELOW

Well, tonight was Taylor's "redemption" that echo had mentioned may happen a few times. Sad that the only reason she did it was to get the reward. There is no actual change in her.

I was disappointed the council just seems worse. DK and Michael are OK, but the older boys just do what they want and then apologize for it afterward.

Hunter deserves a gold star. Of course it really wasn't a surprise. They have been hinting about it for the past few episodes... let me guess, Zach will get the next one.

Did anybody else think the reward was set too easy? That was a pretty small jar. I think the producers wanted the council to make the tough decision, between the arcade and the books. I wonder if Taylor had anything to do with it? After the council decided that Taylor wouldn't get the reward, the producers may have decided to make it easy, just so they could have the "drama" unfold.

It was an OK episode I guess.

Jared was a hoot as usual.

Sophia chosen as Sheriff is interesting. Next week looks pretty cool.

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Wow, green is still piling up the gold stars! At this rate every member of green will have one by the end. Just rename them the Gold Star district.

Being facetious. I actually really agree with Hunter getting it. He's a hard worker.

I'm afraid Sophia is not going to be very popular in her new role, but she's probably the best choice. She's pretty much done the role the whole time, this just makes it official. Can't wait to see what happens next week when they leave and leave her completely in charge of the town.

I was disappointed in Greg and Blaine again. Dk redeemed himself a bit this episode. Greg and Blaine aren't thinking much before acting. I know that's typical of kids, but the other council leaders, as bad as some things they did were, at least seemed to think before they act most of the time.

Yeah, Baron, I agree that the reward seemed a bit easy to get. They gave them all huge boxes of "ammo". It didn't surprise me at all that they won the reward. I would have been surprised if they hadn't won it. Interesting theory about the Taylor thing. They may have, I'm not sure.

I did notice something else tonight though, the gold star winner "Hunter" was shown smiling like he already knew when it was time to announce the winner. I wondered a bit about that. They broadcast his win a lot, yeah. The constant close ups of him during and before the reward challenge got a bit annoying. Had he already been told that he was the winner?

Ok, saved this for last because it always causes such a firestorm on here, but here goes: Taylor. Wow. I don't think she was redeemed at all. Yeah, she worked hard and did the dishes so she could get into the arcade and they had Zach of all people doing the talking to her. I know why of course, it's because of all the nastiness between them earlier. The only one who could get her working was her "arch-nemesis". Awwww, so sweet. Not. If that's what they intended to show it didn't work. I don't even think it fooled or satisfied the youngest kids who watch this show. I wouldn't have minded them showing a redemption of Taylor, but if this was it they cheated her big time. A lot of build up for this? Not even close. They should have shown her being remorseful, shown her working hard, and made it seem a bit more altruistic. The hug with Greg and the Council giving her the letter last week had more meaning than this.

And I'm going to add a bit more so I can really get blasted: I wondered, watching this episode, if Taylor's parents ever make her do anything. Do they ever tell her to do something and make her do it? I get the feeling they don't. I wonder exactly how permissive her parents are, and if they know how badly permissive style parenting can screw up a kid? According to statistics kids of permissive parents are more likely to be promiscuous as teenagers, experiment with drugs, and get into illegal activities. I am NOT SAYING THIS WILL HAPPEN TO TAYLOR! I'm just wondering, from what we have seen on this show, regardless of editing because I know the producers didn't give Taylor a script and tell her to act out lines, if her parents ever tell her "no" or make her do anything.

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Taylor. Wow. I don't think she was redeemed at all. Yeah, she worked hard and did the dishes so she could get into the arcade and they had Zach of all people doing the talking to her. I know why of course, it's because of all the nastiness between them earlier. The only one who could get her working was her "arch-nemesis". Awwww, so sweet. Not. If that's what they intended to show it didn't work. I don't even think it fooled or satisfied the youngest kids who watch this show. I wouldn't have minded them showing a redemption of Taylor, but if this was it they cheated her big time.

Well, I think that's all we are going to see of it. Taylor will probably be background for the rest of the season. You may get a comment here and there, but this whole show as devoted to her. This was the redemption that echo correctly predicted. However, as I mentioned in that past and you pointed out here. She isn't really redeemed. This is the producers attempt to make her look like she had changed. She is no more redeemed now than she was 10 weeks ago. But, that's all the producers had to work with.

And I agree with you Port 100% Taylor's parents need to get a clue on kid raising.

Ugly chickens deserve to die, lol. Taylor cracks me up.

I admit that was kinda funny. I was surprised though, those girls were quick to condemn the poor birds. Ugly or not, I couldn't send a chicken to its death.

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Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhh........ T-A-Y-L-O-R!!! I'm pretty sure there isn't anything she can do now to make me think she isn't the spoiled selfish brat they show her as. Working hard "for arcades" instead of working hard because it's time to change really got to me. I DON'T think she's too young to know better. It's not like she signed up for a show like Real World for Kids where the objective is just to "be there." The whole point of the show leads you to believe you'll have to WORK hard. While I can't say I've never had bratty moments when I was her age.....there is no way I could knowingly continue to come off as a jerk, but I guess I came from parents who disciplined me. No way would I think I could say things on camera or do things that wouldn't come back to haunt me once I got home!

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I was very glad that Hunter finally got his Gold Star.....he has always been a hard worker.

Cute or ugly, I didn't like the chickens being killed....thats just me. I lived on a farm as a small child and I made pets out of all the animals.....my parents always had a hard time with me not wanting to kill the live-stock, or selling them off.

The reward was ok....but I knew the minute they picked the arcade that there would be problems with chores getting done. They had to set limits.

And yes Baron......Jared is still a hoot....he was so funny sneaking into the arcade and playing the dancing game.

Tonights episode was ok. First time my Hubby got to watch it. He thought it was a very interesting show.

JMHO :pixiedust: and I value yours.

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Where do you guys come up with all this mind boggling stuff? You're watching Kid Nation right? This is the year 2007, and this is planet Earth, third planet from the sun in the Milky Way Galaxy? I'm half expecting Rod Serling is going to appear and say to me I've just entered the Twilight zone. I feel like I'm Bob Newhart who's dealing with Larry and his brother Darrel, and his other Brother Darrel.

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TCS, you had to see this train wrecking coming 10 miles away, but believe it or not, I held back from really unloading on this pile. :cheshire:

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TCS, you had to see this train wrecking coming 10 miles away, but believe it or not, I held back from really unloading on this pile.

YES I DID.......sigh! ;):pixiedust:

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I thought about it and decided to remove the bulk of my comments and let it go; this whole defeatist mind set is something that makes no sense to me. There will always be a millions reason why a person can't do something\anything\change, and boggles my mind that people think that way.

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Hmmmmm let it rip. Im interested in what you have to say. I am sure you can say it without flaming anyone here.

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Don't worry. I read it and shared it with mods. Not going to deal with unnecessary comments.

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I'm a Mod. Where's my copy?

Hey, did I blink during the show and miss the part where they actually ATE the chickens???

The musical interlude showing Greg chopping off chicken heads was pretty long. Shouldn't they have shown some of the kids enjoying eating the chickens after all that build-up???

Another thing is that before they showed Sophia and Greg talking about having chickens, for a couple of seconds they showed a few girls in the coop, laughing. Then after the 10 chickens had been selected and removed, they showed the exact same clip, only it was longer this time and ended with Taylor making "ugly chickens need make-up" comments.

Wow, they sure take liberties with the editing!

And speaking of Taylor, that was no "redemption" they showed, in any shape or form.

If she had rolled up her sleeves and done the dishes BEFORE the details of the reward were revealed, then MAYBE I could see it that way. But her working was simply a means to an end - getting herself into that arcade.

So far, she is getting everything she wants, with a minimum of effort. Until that changes, and she starts working for the benefit of the greater good, or out of the kindness of her heart, anything she does will be motivated by self-interest alone.

And I'm not judging her. Frankly, different people mature at different rates, and often in different directions.

She is what she is, which doesn't mean she will always be that way. It just might not change within the 40 days of the show.

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JEDI, I was thinking the same thing about the chicken eating. All that fuss and we don't even get to see them enjoying a huge chicken dinner?

I guess I am judging Taylor, but I don't think she's a lost cause. Nowhere have I ever written that she will definitely never change or anything like that. I think she's a very bright little girl who is spoiled. And I'm definitely judging her parents. If she is spoiled then who else could possibly be to blame? Society? No, the ones who raise her. I should have put links with my comment on statistics I guess, but it's not hard to do a search and come up with the relevant info. After 6 semesters of one type or another of child and adolescent psychology, behavior, and sociology with every single course mentioning the four parenting styles and research on how kids from each tend to turn out I feel I'm pretty qualified to say that if Taylor's parents are permissive-indulgent, as her actions would indicate, then she is at risk.

Echo, I too am curious what your thoughts are on the situation. Like Baron I wish you would post your thoughts, and I know you can do so without blasting or flaming anyone else. I've seen you do it multiple times.

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I just want to say before this thread gets locked. Count to 10 before you post!

Also, like I said, echo had it right. She was shown to be a brat. He said they would show her redeeming herself. And they did. Most of us will agree that her little dish washing endeavor was just to get into the arcade, but the producers want us to believe she's seen the error of her ways.

So lets not argue. This was one of those situations where everybody is right. And nobody here is happy that Taylor is spoiled by her parents. Perhaps its a good thing. If my kid acted like that on TV, Id surely reevaluate my parenting skills.

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I wonder if Taylor is an only child?...or maybe the only girl? I wonder if her mother was in beauty-pagents? :giggle: Just posting my thoughts out loud? :animated_scratchchin:

Echo just doesn't like to see 10 year olds or children bashed. At least thats what I get the feeling from him....and he truely hopes this show will end with ALL the children redeemed just postin my thoughts out loud again :pixiedust:

I think theres lots of kids out there and on the show that don't like chores, choosing the arcade over work just shows you that the other kids made their choice too, and they had to pad-lock the door. JMHO :pixiedust:

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Baron wrote:

Hmmmmm let it rip. Im interested in what you have to say. I am sure you can say it without flaming anyone here.

In the comment I removed I didn't trash anyone specifically, I am very good at staying inbounds by being innovative in the ways that I communicate my points. Nobody asked me to modify my last post, I did it simply because after thinking about it, I felt people are entitled to their defeatist\pessimistic\hopeless reflections of children; I understand that "Taylor" is just a focal point for them to express those mind boggling views. Challenging them on it, only reinforces their unkind views about children. I find these kind of negative perceptions sad, and scary, because when around children those attitudes are at the very least expressed as being passive aggressive directed at the child; you know, a smile on the face saying "Good morning", yet a tone that has a slight hint of disdain\hostility, or comes with a back handed complement "You look nice today, too bad you have very bad BO" A rejected child in school can sense, but not put into words, when a teacher has a subtle negative perception of them. They find themselves somehow always near the back in all the activities, they are graded slightly harder than the rest, and worst, their classmates sense their teacher's preference and fallow that lead; other children will distances themselves from that child and\or torment that child while the teacher looks the other way. Of course in the mind of teachers and adults that do behave like this, in their minds, they are not doing it, they perceive their behavior as being fair\honest\equal to all the children, or that any conscious rejection of some children is somehow deserving and will teach that the "bad kids" some kind valuable life lesson. Several of the proceeding posts reek with this mentality, but of course the posters don't perceive it that way.

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Sometimes, one's own mindset can affect and alter one's perceptions.

So, sometimes the reasons we attrribute for the something we think we saw (like disdain from a teacher) are false, when in actuality what we saw may have been due to something else (like the teacher upset because of something at home), it colours our responsive behaviour, which can result in real disdain from the teacher, thus becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy.

It's easy for people to say we should be less sensitive, but it's not often so easy to do.

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Echo, what I find interesting about you, you are angry with those of us who see Taylor's future as troubled, but you dont say much about Taylor's parents who raised her or the Kid Nation producers who have made an example of her.

Those are the people who you should be pissed at.

Last night, I half expected the producers to have edited footage of the oompa loompas singing about bratty kids.

We dont know how Taylor is going to grow up, but I can tell you she's got a long road to travel.

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Baron wrote

Echo, what I find interesting about you, you are angry with those of us who see Taylor's future as troubled, but you don't say much about Taylor's parents who raised her or the Kid Nation producers who have made an example of her.

To do so would require me to assume that they are doing things right\wrong. How do I not know that tomorrow there won't be an article released saying that Taylor has been sexually abused for the past 5 years by a relative? Or maybe an article stating that for the past 5 years her entire family volunteers on Christmas day to deliver meals to the elderly. I could come up with and endless series of posibilities that would demostate that everyone of these kids is more than what they are on this reality show.

The difference is that I accept there is far too much I don't know to make an good assessment of anyone of these children, therefore I give them the benefit of the doubt. You, and several others, prefer to assume that things are far worse than what is shown, that what is shown is just the glimpse of the real horror horror show in Taylor's day to day life. I have no doubt that when you think of her life back home, its seriously dysfunctional and her parents are doing all the wrong things. While I agree it could be that way, I just don't make that assumption based on knowing next to nothing about some 10 year old girl on a reality show that has its own agenda which I, at best, can only speculate about. And even then, my speculation sides with being optimistic about what the show is striving to be by the very end.

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OK, can't argue with that really. We don't know what Taylor's upbringing is like. We... or at least I, am only assuming. I can't speak for the others. But, SOMETHING, whether it is her parents, her uncle, her dog... whatever. SOMETHING, is amiss in Taylor's life. The footage we see is enough to make that assessment. It's not just creative editing. So perhaps it is wrong to try and pinpoint exactly why Taylor is the way she is, but SOMEONE, preferably her parents, should address it. That's my opinion.

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This is in NO WAY meant as a flame, and neither was my last post. I apologize if it sounded like it was. I seriously just wanted to hear everyone's opinion. Including Echo's.

We all make judgements every day, millions of times a day. And I'll agree with part of what you said Echo, a lot of times we don't even admit it. You make judgements on what others on here write and in so doing judge the life of the poster behind the post. I do too. It's probably not a good thing to do, because really any of us could be completely different from what we seem. Any one of us might be a mother theresa in real life that posts the exact opposite on here. Not saying they are, or that I am, just saying it's possible. However, on the show we are seeing kids being themselves. Yes, in a new and different environment, but still a lot of who they are is going to shine through. On a message board it is easy to hide who you are if you so wish. On camera on a reality show, not so much. You'd have to be acting 24/7 and never slip up. I don't think even the best actor could pull that off. In the case of children, I think it's even less likely.

I judge every kid on that show. I'm judging Sophia when I say she deserved to be made sherrif. I was judging Laurel when I said she deserved the gold star. I'm judging Greg when I say he's quick tempered. And these are kids we are seeing weekly on television. Just imagine the judging I do at the grocery store when parents bring their children in, (or the judging being leveled at me when I take my niece or nephews with me). A mom walking down the aisle laughing and yakking on her cell while her screaming children shove people, run over people, almost trip the little old lady reaching for the loaf of bread, and pull things off shelves? Yep I'm judging her. The dad that comes in with his very polite young daughter who picks up the little old lady's loaf of bread off the floor and hands it to her? Yep I'm judging him too.

I will be the first to say I don't truly know what Taylor's home life is like, but I can sure make a guess, which is judging, and I do and did.

My only point here is that we all make judgements every single day. It's a fact of life. Why is it not ok to judge Taylor's parents, but it's ok to judge a poster by their posts? I might be 14 and lying about my age for all anyone on here knows. It's impossible not to judge.

As for teachers, well I completely disagree. Most teachers would never treat any student in that manner regardless. Teachers these days go through extensive training to hide their negative judgements in front of their students. It's not possible for them to do away with them, and so they are taught to go out of their way to be polite to all their students at all times, and specifically taught not to be passive agressive. However, there's a huge difference between a teacher in a classroom full of children that he or she is directly influencing, and someone watching a child they will never even meet on a reality show.

As TCS says, this is just my opinion. Hope this wasn't off base or seen as flaming because it certainly isn't meant to be. To me it's just a fun debate. If any mod thinks my post is inappropriate then I respect that and will not take it personally if they feel it should be moved/deleted/edited.

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Port wrote:

As TCS says, this is just my opinion. Hope this wasn't off base or seen as flaming because it certainly isn't meant to be. To me it's just a fun debate. If any mod thinks my post is inappropriate then I respect that and will not take it personally if they feel it should be moved/deleted/edited.

I understand the intent and didn't pick up any subtle contradictions to suggest otherwise.

Port wrote:

As for teachers, well I completely disagree. Most teachers would never treat any student in that manner regardless. Teachers these days go through extensive training to hide their negative judgements in front of their students. It's not possible for them to do away with them, and so they are taught to go out of their way to be polite to all their students at all times, and specifically taught not to be passive agressive. However, there's a huge difference between a teacher in a classroom full of children that he or she is directly influencing, and someone watching a child they will never even meet on a reality show.

I am pretty good at understanding human nature and social interactions, and there is no doubt in my mind that if a teacher doesn't like a student, at the very least, at a subconscious level the teacher's body language and other uncontrollable cues will communicate to the child that the teacher doesn't like the child. Sometimes is not that the child is treated rudely or even badly, but a child can see how the teacher interacts with children who the teacher really likes, and can feel the difference.

My previous example in my last post was more extreme to illustrate my point, I think what is more common is similar to very subtle racism. With the case of racism, a teacher clearly knows not say\do anything directly that might be perceived as racist, but if a teacher is racist, it will be expressed in subtle and small ways even when the teacher is unaware of it. When a teacher doesn't like a child, it can't be completely hidden, but hidden just enough that it can't be identified by a specific act or comment, yet the child can still feel it, like a minority child can sense that a racist teacher perceives them a second class student. One example that comes to mind was watching an adult talk to a group of boys that had one little black boy, she talked fairly normal to white boys, but always tended to talk slower and simpler to the black boy. I don't believe she was aware that she was treating the black boy so differently. She wasn't being mean towards the boy, but it appeared to me she had some minor racist attitudes that blacks boys weren't quite as smart. I can see a teacher being just as unaware about minor changes in behavior when dealing with children the teacher doesn't like.

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Everyone makes assumptions based on what they know. We are humans after all. Everyone here has made assumptions about the kids on KN, and other posters here.

With that being said, this was an ok episode:

They really should have seen the problems that the arcade would bring.

Sophia should have made breakfast for herself, and not everyone else. She's too nice sometimes.

Why would they show kids gambling? I guess they kinda had to show it to explain why he wasn't in the kitchen, but they are asking for trouble there.

Taylor needs to be taught that not being pretty doesn't mean you should die. That's a messed up way of thinking, and she needs some help in that.

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but the producers want us to believe she's seen the error of her ways.

Honestly, I do not believe the producers are trying to make us believe anything. They made it pretty clear that it was only after she was all alone with the chickens that Zach came to her and talked her into doing some work. I would not be surprised if it was Zach who went to the Town Council and pointed out that Taylor was working. I think the producers have shown that the TC has repeatedly offered Taylor ways out, and again would not be surprised if the off-camera counseling didn't suggest a carrot and stick approach. At times it was clumsily executed, but these are kids and Taylor is extremely stubborn.

The irony for me is that being a beauty pageant contestant is constantly being told what to do, by officials who set the rules, and by the parents who drive them to compete. That she doesn't want to take orders from others could be a rebellion against that, or it could be that she is spoiled and used to getting her own way all the time. I don't really know. I just don't buy into the notion that the whole season is being packaged for a redemption message on Day 40. I think the show reflects what happened. Sure there is plenty of editing and some scenes may be technically out of sequence, but I believe the story itself remains intact.

As I said, Zach deserves credit for talking Taylor into working but I think Greg and Blaine were much better this episode. I imagine they have never been in this type of leadership role before, and there is a very quick learning curve to grow into the role in such a short time. We have seen less of the journal discussion, and less of the gold star discussion than in past episodes, so we have seen less of what the TC has talked about in making its decisions. For me, there was improvement this week over last and that's all I can ask for. The ultimate question is how these kids will take the lessons they have learned and apply them to their real lives.

And here is another question I'll toss out for you. With only a couple episodes left and the revelation that a final $50k gold star will be awarded, and assuming that $20k gold star winners are not eligible, who deserves the final big award? It seems to me that as the era of Bonanza city winds down, the kids are wearing out, and wearying of the daily grind. So of the remaining 25 kids (12 will have already won Gold Stars and 3 kids left Bonanza City), who deserves the $50k gold star? Your choices are:

Alex, Anjay, Brett, Campbell, Colton, Divad, Emilie, Eric, Gianna, Guylan, Jared, Jasmine, Kelsey, Leila, Madison, Maggie, Markelle, Migle, Mike, Natasha, Olivia, Pharaoh, Randi, Savannah, Sophie, Taylor and Zach

Fuskie

Who believes that the kids talk about who they want to nominate for the Gold Star when they line up to give their opinion to the Town Council, which would explain how the finalists seem to have a pretty good idea that they have a chance to be named...

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